Excessive noise? To discuss

Forest is people. People is you. You is us.
Post Reply
User avatar
niall
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:00 pm
Location: Perth
Contact:

Excessive noise? To discuss

Post by niall » Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:48 pm

Hi folks

There was an incident on Sunday evening that I thought I should raise for discussion. I was in the cafe with a few friends, one of whom is recovering from a severe ear infection. A band, the name of which I don't know, were tuning up, and then, albeit briefly, performing.

Now, I was of the view that the music was excessively amplified for the size of the venue. I found it painful. My friend (it's now Tuesday) remains in a great deal of pain that was made much worse at the time - when she was trying to eat her dinner in the cafe in peace and quiet. We ordered just at the time the band was tuning up. I doubt she'll be back in.

I don't want to get in the way of music in the Forest (Gods forbid), or even of loud music in the Forest, but when matters of health intervene, and when members and potential members of the community are that alienated, I think it's time we had a discussion on the subject.

Obviously, it's difficult to quantify when users are going to become alienated, and equally difficult to quantify when a band (also users, let's remember) is going to become alienated because they are told they have to turn the amp down!

It is possible to quantify noise. I would estimate that the noise produced by this band was in the region of 115-120 deciBels (see http://www.hsmc.co.uk/noise_levels.html). There was also one, admittedly accidental, very loud bang (rifle shot level) which had me in some discomfort and my friend in clear agony (ie, in tears). By comparison, 85 dB is the lower workplace limit where hearing protectors must be worn in cases of repeated/constant exposure.

Legally, at 112 dB you have a limit of one minute of exposure before workers (that's kitchen staff!) require hearing protectors (see http://www.hsmc.co.uk/noise_law.html). I wasn't measuring it, but I am under the impression that this may well have been exceeded on Sunday.

Incidentally, initially there was no room for me and three friends in the outer room, so it was abandon dinner, or put up with it.

Now, perhaps as a result of an oversight, there was nothing on the blackboard about a band playing at around 6:30pm. In fact, there was nothing about what was going to be on during the course of Sunday at all. Again, probably an oversight. Perhaps when I was in on Sunday I should have checked the events book and updated the blackboard. One of these things where it's everyone's responsibility so nobody does it! Mea culpa, at least partially.

I recognise that some people like this kind of loud music, and the Forest exists largely as an outlet for this kind of artistic expression, even if it's not to my taste.

I propose the following, more as a starting point for discussion than anything I expect to be final:
* Loud music should be limited to certain times of the day, certainly after mealtimes. As a starting point, I suggest 9pm.
* The band should make it clear in the events book that we are talking about loud music, and this should be made clear on the events blackboard by whoever writes it up, so that those wanting to protect their hearing can avoid having to move when it suddenly becomes clear that your eardrums are in danger!
* Perhaps there should also be an announcement before such a band starts tuning up?

OK, what do others think?

cheers

Niall

swithun
Posts: 2683
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:24 pm

Post by swithun » Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:47 pm

I asked around and got some conflicting suggestions, some of which are fit to be repeated.

One the one hand, the cafe is primarily a place for artists to express themselves, as you mentioned. If the odd customer has a problem with an artist's expression, then tough. Also, bands need to sound check, and this happens prior to the performance's stated time. So you may think you can escape a band by coming in early, but not always. And putting up signs saying 'warning: loud music at 9pm' is a bit like having someone walk in front of a car waving a red flag, or saying that the coffee may be hot.

But, on the other hand, the cafe's PA is tricky to use, and sound checks could be made shorter and less traumatic if we offered training to bands and sound engineers. The band in question might have demands higher than their skills with our equipment. Also, we do have to be considerate to our neighbours (if not the customers), so even we have our limits, regarding sound levels. And you are right that the information and publicity does have the occasional omission. But we are dependent on what artists write in the events book, and what people feel like putting on the events board. The more information artists give us, the better for everyone. I didn't know in advance who was going to be playing, but if I had and had been asked by a customer, I would have said that it was going to be loud.

I don't think anyone wanted your friend to be hurt by the music. But I imagine the epileptics know better than go to night clubs and people with food allergies have to be careful what they eat. It is a shame that some people can't enjoy their peanuts under a strobe and some megawatted industrial music, but that's life. I think the Forest is where you can only expect the unexpected, and prepare accordingly.

Warning: the opinions expressed above are contradictory and should be taken with not more than 6g of salt. This post contains traces of the alphabet.

User avatar
Shannon
Posts: 2752
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:12 pm
Location: there and then

Post by Shannon » Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:24 pm

I think it is unreasonable to expect loud music only after 9pm. On the other hand, it isn't unreasonable to give a warning before soundcheck begins.

We do our best to post stuff up on the board. If it isn't posted, please ask before you place your order and we will be happy to tell you as much as we know.

We probably have to discuss our maximum sound levels further. Soundproofing is better these days, but kitchen workers are a good point.

We will be in touch with the band before their next gig to see if we can arrange a shorter/quieter/more efficient soundcheck.

User avatar
chris
Posts: 2638
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 1:50 am
Location: heartland
Contact:

Post by chris » Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:47 pm

zap
Maybe it could work? But it will be a kaleidoscopic blend of mysterious shadows and rainbow hued-dreams seen through compassionate tears.

User avatar
mark
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 12:33 pm

Post by mark » Tue Jun 12, 2007 7:24 pm

dear friend,

in my research it is clear that the noise of ants walking is the region of 18.7dB, and the loudest sound ever recorded by humans is 107.3dB (incidently the loudest sound ever recorded by human beings was the sound of chaffinches mating in leeds.. now there has been some consideration that were animals to measure sound they may take a different approach and the number could go up or down, but lets leave that for now, we can come back to it later, if the argument merits it, which i EXTREMELY doubt.).

my band 'silent electrical death by acute involuntary asphixiation (sic)' will be playing at random times around cafes in edinburgh, glasgow and new york... a kind of guerrila gigging but in cafes.. be assured that we will be louder then anything ever. also we are aiming to were extrremely bright colours (if colours were sound then we are talking 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
99999999999999dB)
so as well as defeaning you we may also blind you... better wear dark glaseses...

yup, oh yup.

what of course this means is that picking a cafe in any of these cities has become russian roulette with you ears and eyes... thus ruling the forest back in! and making you tread more edgily in the cafe etc.s/kilimanjaros/ands the glorious starbuckese out there...

MARK
Last edited by mark on Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
the pen is mightier than the word

User avatar
niall
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:00 pm
Location: Perth
Contact:

Post by niall » Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:05 am

Hi folks

I'm pleased to see intelligent discussion taking place on this. Thanks, folks. I'm sorry that some suggestions are not fit to be repeated. My intention was not to create bad feeling!

As regards Mark's comments, I'm taking my sound measurement levels from here: http://www.hsmc.co.uk/noise_levels.html I assume they know what they're talking about (because I don't - that's why I went looking for experts!).

My own responses are purely subjective - when it becomes uncomfortable, it's too discordant or too loud. Since I can say this about some Prokoviev (5th Symphony, if I remember right - the satire on Soviet industrialisation?), this isn't a problem limited to the Forest!

On the other hand, even I have a Deep Purple collection....

The last thing I want to do is interfere with someone's self-expression. There does come a point where others can be hurt, and at that point a civilised compromise has to be talked about. That's what community, to me, is all about.

Swithun's idea of training for people using the sound system is a good one, and I can see why there would be issues about saying that certain things could only happen after certain times. I dunno though. I've seen young children and dogs in the Forest during the day. I would not inflict that kind of volume on either of them. It reminds me of some of the arguments that smokers use, roughly paraphrased as "I have a right to pollute the space, so if you don't like it, get out!"

On the other hand, smoking has less to do with self-expression.

I'm not claiming it's simple. I'm just asking that we guidelines/groundrules. The Forest does have groundrules - not many, quite properly, but there are good reasons for things like putting your accommodation request in the flat book and not on the noticeboard. I suppose what I'm saying is that we should ask people to be polite and consider the needs of others.

When it comes to expecting the unexpected, I wasn't expecting CIRCA/GlasgowKiss in the cafe later in the evening, but it was fun!! On the other hand, my Indian friends had left by that time. The Gods alone know what they'd have made of the Clowns!! :? :lol:

hth

Niall

User avatar
mark
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 12:33 pm

Post by mark » Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:51 am

you shuold be barred. in my other cafe you are.

incidently i dont think much to the site you mentioned: http://www.hsmc.co.uk/noise_levels.html

its rubbish. seems like they got some stuff extremely wrong.. they say:

10dB = Falling leaf
140dB = Jet taking off

so fourteen leaves falling at once is as loud as a jetplane? those are fuking big leaves! i mean like giant massive leaves. once i was living in guatamala, in a small house, a wooden house actually, on the edge of the forest, there was another time, when i was helping angelina move her water pots, it was a long time, and these large leaves surrounded us, it seemed that they were an emerald green coluor, like her eyes, except without the fire of passion. i spoke to them. of course they didnt speak back, i spoke to them again, but the reply was silent.. "fukk you leaves i said." these leaves didnt take any goading and they just stayed there fukking silent. so i burnt the leaves..

i suggest you do the same.

if that fails i often find this site is good for spending some time:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/sho ... p?t=120247

they have a very good comparison on all manner of things.

much love my friend.

MARK
the pen is mightier than the word

User avatar
Martin
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:35 pm

Post by Martin » Wed Jun 13, 2007 1:56 am

10dB = Falling leaf
140dB = Jet taking off

so fourteen leaves falling at once is as loud as a jetplane?


The decibel (dB) is a logarithmic unit. The difference between 10dB and 140dB is a factor of 10^13, not 14. So more like ten trillion leaves fallling at once is as loud as a jet plane.

Not that you clearly give a f*ck.

User avatar
mark
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 12:33 pm

Post by mark » Wed Jun 13, 2007 12:17 pm

that is a lot of leaves! but it raises the question are there that many leaves?

perhaps Niall is right. and we should keep noise defenders for such situations. Or even tell the band that they are too loud, and explain to them that is ok if they are as noisy as 5 million leaves but not 14 trillion. Or to put it more clearly to them, its ok if the volume is as loud as the roar of a bullfight in madrid when heard from barceolna, but not the sound of a space craft exploading in your kitchen, when you're trying to have a shower, now, that would piss off, even me! not just the noise, but having to get the whole kitchen refitted, and maybe the roof repaired too? not great :(
the pen is mightier than the word

User avatar
niall
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:00 pm
Location: Perth
Contact:

Post by niall » Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:29 pm

mark wrote:
perhaps Niall is right. and we should keep noise defenders for such situations. Or even tell the band that they are too loud, and explain to them that is ok if they are as noisy as 5 million leaves but not 14 trillion.


Mark

In fact, if you actually read what I wrote, I suggested nothing of the sort.

I made some suggestions, and expected constructive discussion, not puerile ridicule.

Thankfully, most members of the Forest community are above this level. Perhaps you would like to engage positively in ensuring that nobody else is hurt and alienated as my friend was on Sunday?

User avatar
chris
Posts: 2638
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 1:50 am
Location: heartland
Contact:

Post by chris » Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:40 pm

I think I may have been in one time when these people were playing, and it was very loud.

if the kitchen volunteers feel it is too loud they can ask that it be turned down, which i believe has always been the rule. it may have got lost in the mists of time however, so they should be reminded of this.

Niall is right, in that the forest is a place for artists, experimentation and to a degree chaos. but it would be nice if the audience/customers were not in conflict with the art/performance, but i suppose somtimes this may be the point of the work? Forest is not really the place for peace and quiet, but pain and discomfort is not good either.

i think if a band is going to be noisy an announcement is a great idea, but i think the other two suggestions are flawed.

1. limiting times when people can be noisy is, in my view too restrictive upon artistic freedom, and thus undesirable.

2. people using the events book repeatedly fail to fill it out correctly, frequently not putting their phone number etc. so it is unlikely to help much if we ask them to tell us if they will be loud.

maybe others could consider the need to announce soundchecks, and remind volunteers of that they can ask acts to turn it down if its way too loud.

Chris
Maybe it could work? But it will be a kaleidoscopic blend of mysterious shadows and rainbow hued-dreams seen through compassionate tears.

User avatar
ravanwin
Posts: 5060
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 8:08 pm
Location: edinburgh
Contact:

Post by ravanwin » Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:43 pm

sounds like a once in a while thing to me and not really all that important to worry about in terms of our policy etc.

in fact, it is better to have loud bands play earlier as it is less a problem for the neighbors.

if the problem is persistent, then it might be worth discussing more in depth but, at the moment, forest work-load is high and installing soloutions to a rather minimal and infrequent (in my opinion) might be a waste of time.

That said, if this continues to have negative affects, i would think it worth looking into simple soloutions.

does that make sense / not sound purile.

I think this mark guy hangs out at favorit.

User avatar
niall
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:00 pm
Location: Perth
Contact:

Post by niall » Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:56 pm

Hi Ryan

No, I don't think this sounds puerile at all. I think it's a positive contribution.

I don't entirely agree, however.

If it's simply a case of reminding the kitchen managers that they can ask that the volume be turned down (perhaps being able to do so at the request of other members of the community), and having guidelines for artists that they should fill out the events book properly, including a note that they might be really loud (Aural Sex spring to mind here, and in their case noise is part of their creative expression!), and announcing what might be an aurally uncomfortable sound check, I don't really seeing it being a big job.

If it's a rare case, and I'm inclined to agree, then it shouldn't have to happen too often anyway!

User avatar
mark
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 12:33 pm

Post by mark » Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:47 pm

niall wrote:Thankfully, most members of the Forest community are above this level.


I AM short it is true, but making fun of me is not the fair thing to do. i do not like that i cant see into others eyes properly unless they really look down on me (or i stand on a ladder). and all the time it seems they are looking down of me. for you to call me a ridicule is also not fair.

and also why has no one helped with my question about trees? martin, what was rude to me? he can do sums. maybe he can work out if it is possible for there to be 14 trillion leaves? is there enough trees? where would they be kept? and if you had leaves in two piles from differnt makes of tree (say oak and sycamore) if you mixed the leaves would it be one pile of leaves or one pile of mixed leaves?

all this talk of trees and logs and forests, its strange? is it? where is my firend georg, he would understand, and help me.

even my band 'silent electrical death by acute involuntary asphixiation (sic)' are turning against me and threatening to go acoustic! it pisses me off.

always yours

MAAAAAAAARK
the pen is mightier than the word

Fils d'Abeille
Posts: 110
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:01 am
Contact:

Post by Fils d'Abeille » Wed Jun 13, 2007 4:37 pm

Mark, I can't let you go on mispelling that word. There is a y in asphyxiation. What can deluded half wit hooked you up with that spelling?

http://dictionary.reference.com/search? ... phyxiation

this page will tell you something about asphyxiation, but not, alas, anything about leaves.

Good luck to you.

User avatar
Gaz
Posts: 1373
Joined: Sat Apr 09, 2005 8:24 am

Post by Gaz » Wed Jun 13, 2007 4:46 pm

Bring back the legendary silent jam!
the more you think, the more you stink

chombee
Posts: 1327
Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 3:01 pm

Post by chombee » Wed Jun 13, 2007 4:48 pm

KMs maybe, but rare is the volunteer who will ask the band to turn down the volume, even if they wanted to.

If any poster or leaflet or other communication is to be made about this, then measuring noise in terms of trillions of leaves falling is an excellent idea.

No one at the forest should be above puerile ridicule.

Niall has made some good points. People could be hurt, volunteers could be hurt, a dog could probably be killed or something. I actually think we should do something about this.

Also in general, about warning people ahead of time when the cafe is about to suddenly turn into a gig space. We do so many other things well. We always remember to close the shutters and put out candles. So with rigorous application of self discipline we should be able to train ourselves to do something about this too. It's not only noise. People ordering a meal 5 mins. before a gig is not really appropriate. And the laptop people: we hate them I know, but maybe they didn't know a gig was about to happen and if they did they wouldn't have been using their laptop. etc.

When I've been NMing, often I don't know that a gig is about to happen. Bands seem to just wander in, set up, start playing. No one ever says hi to me, you know.
I've had it with you. If I had an image of a laser gun I would absolutely position it right here in my hand...
Ha! I have a real laser absolutely positioned in my hand!

User avatar
Gandhi
Posts: 769
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:57 pm
Location: your moms house

Post by Gandhi » Wed Jun 13, 2007 5:40 pm

After playing at the Forest on numerous occasions, it's quite difficult for the musicians to grasp just how loud they may be playing, simply due to the fact that they are often performing behind the speakers/PA system and amps and as the sound is projecting away from them it simply doesn't seem as loud.
This isn't an excuse as I too get irratated when things are so loud that everyhting becomes a mess of sound. I think that the sound level should be kept more in proportion with the size of venue. Playing as the same volume as a larger venue is not only ridiculous but its also technically poor.
Obviously its a balance between artistic freedom and audience comfort and the nature of the Forest makes it difficult for people to know exactly what the bands going to be like (which is the beauty of the place) but i do think they should be able to come to the Forest knowing that whoever is playing, be it a folk acoustic guitarist to a metal band, they are not going to want to leave simply down to the noise level.
I personally think there should be an upper limit, and how this is set is obviously not up to me, and don't get me wrong I love big loud gigs but thats simply because the upper audio level is kept in proportion to the venue.
another quick point that may be worth noting is that if any Health and Safety officials came on a night where the audio was too loud they may kick up a fuss/stop the gig!!!

Im not around the Forest as much as I like, but will try and help out on the mixing desk next time I'm there. I will also bring in a great book called Audio in Media by Stanley Alten which talks about sounds levels and audio techiciany stuff in a pretty simple way which would be a usefull guide to any volunteers who wanted to learn about setting up the sound etc. I'll organise for it to be left below the mixing desk or something.
It's like God's vagina!

User avatar
ravanwin
Posts: 5060
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 8:08 pm
Location: edinburgh
Contact:

Post by ravanwin » Wed Jun 13, 2007 6:10 pm

Fils d'Abeille wrote:Mark, I can't let you go on mispelling that word. There is a y in asphyxiation. What can deluded half wit hooked you up with that spelling?

http://dictionary.reference.com/search? ... phyxiation

this page will tell you something about asphyxiation, but not, alas, anything about leaves.

Good luck to you.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic

so --- perhaps you should look at this:

The word sic may be used either to show that an uncommon or archaic usage is reported faithfully (for instance, quoting the U.S. Constitution, "The House of Representatives shall chuse [sic] their Speaker...") or to highlight an error, often for the purpose of ridicule or irony,

Fils d'Abeille
Posts: 110
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 2:01 am
Contact:

Post by Fils d'Abeille » Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:05 pm

I'm sorry... I was hiding from my own mistake,

yours,

deluded half-wit

User avatar
Martin
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:35 pm

Post by Martin » Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:40 pm

We could get a noise meter for the cafe for £49 and agree a real volume limit, rather than bickering about who thought what was too loud.

User avatar
Martin
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:35 pm

Post by Martin » Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:49 pm

Or £20 for a simpler analogue one.

User avatar
Gandhi
Posts: 769
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:57 pm
Location: your moms house

Post by Gandhi » Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:25 pm

i think an audio level meter is a great idea.
It's like God's vagina!

User avatar
bill
Posts: 608
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:43 pm

Post by bill » Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:52 pm

case by case, when its clearly too loud and is so for ages just turn it down. i am completely opposed to wasting money on loud-ometers.....seriously.....when it hurts us for ages turn it down.....try messenger or something....also our p.a's top limit is 99db.....

User avatar
Dandolo
Posts: 487
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:17 pm
Location: Edinburgh

Post by Dandolo » Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:34 pm

gadgetry is the refuge of the imminently deaf dumb and blind

User avatar
chris
Posts: 2638
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 1:50 am
Location: heartland
Contact:

Post by chris » Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:42 pm

we already have these fancy sound meters, they are a lot of fun.
Maybe it could work? But it will be a kaleidoscopic blend of mysterious shadows and rainbow hued-dreams seen through compassionate tears.

User avatar
Jimmy Bastard
Posts: 1210
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 4:59 pm
Location: Heaven sent, hell bent & unrepentant

Post by Jimmy Bastard » Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:48 pm

i have always wanted a Clap-O-Metre
did the technology ever go digital
if not
that's an exploitable niche
if yes
then
i want
Pep Up The Turmoil

iamjohnmarra
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:18 pm
Location: Edinburgh by way of Queens

Post by iamjohnmarra » Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:24 pm

mixed leaves are still leaves, so the pile of mixed leaves, become just one pile of leaves.

it aint hard...

instead of a clap o meter, why not just use pigeons?
boom bip with a brother named tip and i'm ready to flip

swithun
Posts: 2683
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:24 pm

Post by swithun » Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:38 pm

Instead of a clapometer, why not just go to the doctor?

User avatar
lucky
Posts: 1460
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Edinburgh
Contact:

solution

Post by lucky » Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:53 pm

[someone else] bought a decibel meter....it is by the til. its plugged in....it automatically detects the ambient sound of the cafe before and after any given noise, contrasts it and the dial indicates the "noise level"....its pretty good and cheap.....it has a built in mic....please don't change the settings on it it took ages for [them] to calibrate unless you have read the manual which [they] have so know you haven't.

peace out peoples

x

[i forgot to log out, someone mistakedly posted on my name. I haven't a clue about technical stuff so please never, ever ask me to fix it. Thanks, Alex*]
Last edited by lucky on Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
niall
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:00 pm
Location: Perth
Contact:

Re: solution

Post by niall » Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:04 pm

StarFragment wrote:i have bought a decibel meter....it is by the til. its plugged in....it automatically detects the ambient sound of the cafe before and after any given noise, contrasts it and the dial indicates the "noise level"....its pretty good and cheap.....it has a built in mic....please don't change the settings on it it took ages for me to calibrate unless you have read the manual which i have so know you haven't.

peace out peoples

x


Yeah!! Overload on the clapometer!!

User avatar
Shannon
Posts: 2752
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:12 pm
Location: there and then

Post by Shannon » Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:13 pm

I can't believe this is the 31st post on this topic!

What is the plan? If we shall not have a policy, it probably should go in the NM letter. That way, maybe some of them won't end up in chombee's situation (not knowing they can ask the band to turn it down).

User avatar
bill
Posts: 608
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:43 pm

Post by bill » Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:33 pm

i love you all

User avatar
bill
Posts: 608
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 7:43 pm

Post by bill » Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:34 pm

well if alex's purchase was any good we should be able to judge it on case by case thing....so its all fine..it tells you when its too loud....

User avatar
mark
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 12:33 pm

Post by mark » Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:10 pm

if that is it solved then i still wonder about the 14 trillion leaves? maybe a large box to hold them in would help? we could get children to arrange them into colours of the harvest? or could we?
the pen is mightier than the word

User avatar
dan
Posts: 1410
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 1:04 pm

Post by dan » Fri Jun 15, 2007 10:57 am

yeah leaves huh? I reallly like them. especially in the autumn(or Fall for our North-Atlantic cousins, w can be culturally sensitive too...) . and ESPECIALLY in the autumn (or Fall) when they have little cats and puppies playing in them. I don't know how much that affects the sound, but I suppose it would quite extensively, like if you had 4 million cats and 25 puppies in the leaves, how many leaves would you need to make to sound of the sun exploding?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Our big brother's got no heart,
when I get my chance I'm going to punch him in the nose, in the nose, in the nose

User avatar
Gandhi
Posts: 769
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:57 pm
Location: your moms house

Post by Gandhi » Fri Jun 15, 2007 1:16 pm

also if 14 trillion leaves fell off of the infamous Northern Japanese Silent Leaf Tree you wouldn't hear a thing!!!!

4 million cats to just 25 puppies...the puppies would have a hard time trying to control their urges to chase the cats...but if they did then surely they would be overpowered by the cats. thats a ratio of 160000 cats:1 puppy...crikey!!!

and what would be the volume of 4 million cats purring...and how many fleas would there be? I'm just terrified that this situation could occur. I'm moving to the Isle of Dogs in London where there are no cats just to make sure.
it was nice meeting you all...and I'll pray for you. God Speed.
It's like God's vagina!

Post Reply