the extent of foh autonomy

Front of House, garden etc.
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Shannon
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the extent of foh autonomy

Postby Shannon » Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:01 am

Jane says:
(for example, FOH wanted to repaint a room, is this impacting forest, does it depend which-room-where, or is it all their call and if you care about it you should be attending the FOH meetings)?


I think this is important, and it will affect the foh mission. It's one thing to be able to buy some flowers and sew slip covers for couches. Painting over a mural is quite another...
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Postby chris » Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:40 am

I always thought of front of house as being day to day appearance and presentation. flowers, candels, sofa covers, arranging furniture. maybe touching up some paintwork if it was fucked up, but not ever actually repainting anything.

colour schemes and big changes i think would belong in galleries.
(or visual arts, if that was a wg)
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Postby Dandolo » Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:51 am

I'd say total autonomy or else it's just a bunch of "duties" and not a whole bundle of fun, which means they won't get done. It's a little unjust if there's a separate WG that dictates murals and wall painting.
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Postby ravanwin » Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:23 am

i think it's improtant that the visual side of forest has a hand in choosing murals for the main rooms. not so much the painting or anything. if FOH wants to change the colour scheme, i say go for it.

however, they would have to 1. get an excess budget approved, and 2. consider the impact on the forest community. ie painting the projection wall black is bad.

i think if FOH has awesome mural idea they should be looked at by the visual arts side (but not necessarily the forest working group). However, since a mural costs money and effects the whole i does need another level of scrutiny. maybe a long term goal should be to get rid of that step? I do see how it can turn into all work and no play.

I think FOH can work the decor. It's not painting, but it's something. Lampshardes, couch covers, flowers, strange things a hanging, odd bits of table, etc.... i believe creative people can make the job interesting without painting murals.

r
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Postby chris » Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:41 am

improving furniture is another one.

i used to like it when i did front of house.

but its a good point dan makes. what about not having foh as a working group, but figuring out all the responsibilities and dividing them or rotating them between the other groups?
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Postby Jane » Tue Nov 28, 2006 11:37 am

i agree with ryan.

foh has a tendency to be a fancyname for "tidying up". if it's shared between people it's not so bad though, and then there can be more time for creative-ing
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Postby Shannon » Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:07 pm

Yeah, there could be a balance between the responsibilities of tidying/making things presentable on one hand, and the fun of putting your own touch on things, on the other.

I agree that a major mural should be coordinated with the arts, while painting something new on a table, or putting up crazy new decorations should not. The budget limit seems like a good way to balance this...
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Postby beev » Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:28 pm

Budget limits in no way define how much you can and can't do. You could do tons of cool things on no budget, and you could also spend a shitload and achieve nothing.

I agree with Ryan. Murals for art people, colour scheme for FoH. Painting tables would seem to fall inbetween. I think either could do it, with approval from the politburo.
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Postby Jane » Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:05 pm

"Murals for art people, colour scheme for FoH. Painting tables would seem to fall inbetween"

eh? what's colour scheme?

personally, i would put FOH freedom this far (plus obviosuly all tidying/flowery/general niceties):

OK:
changing furniture, finding new things in skips and chucking out old bad stuff
repainting tables
painting/decorating basement
painting/decorating toilets
doing up shutters
kitchen/worktops

NOT OK:
painting murals
painting walls upstairs
paiting outside
painting over something someone has done without letting them know first so they can take a picture for posterity...............
& anything that costs over budget


making the group have to report back too much (can i paint on this table please?) is demoralising and leads to things not getting done as momentum and interest is lost, plus it's not the business is it of the forest working group. if people care about this level of specifics they should be going to a FOH meeting.
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Postby beev » Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:35 pm

Colour scheme may not be the best term, but obviously it refers to the colour of the paint that's on the walls, doors, shelves etc.
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Postby beev » Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:35 pm

painting/decorating basement
painting/decorating toilets
doing up shutters

These things will conflict with this:
painting murals

if we have murals on the walls downstairs/in the toilets/on the shutters

Or does it mean FoH has the responsibility of finding the artists to paint those murals?
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Postby Jane » Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:45 pm

oh, then i disagree on colour scheme, i think it should be at least be brought up with forest WG as it's a huge change and people should have the chance to discuss it.

muralwise, i wasn't clear, i meant

upstairs mural = bad
stair mural = bad

basement = ok
toilets = ok

shutter = ok to paint them subtle, a big crazy mural should be discussed
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Postby chris » Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:17 pm

this is why i think maybe front of house should be divided up between all groups, i know its a weird idea (maybe even a bad one) but it would mean its very celar which group is responsible for all things on the wall, maybe a list of standard foh responsibilities would help? traditionally they have been:

tidying/ cleaning
flowers
candles
sofa covers
arranging furniture
touching up some paintwork
getting cool furntiure
looking after plants
having cool lamphsades
table tops (i would claim this is not foh)
some murals (i would claim this is not foh)

in the past theses jobs have tended to be neglected, probably cos most of the jobs are boring. the kitchen seems to be able to handle candles and flowers ok... (and these are very regular things) maybe plants could go with garden/environmental, touching up paintwork with galleries/building. that mainly just leaves more creative things...

i think colour changes and murals should all be within galleries/ visual arts..

maybe a joint foh/galleries/visual arts discussion is required?
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beev
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Postby beev » Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:53 pm

Do we actually want plants in the cafe? All they ever seem to do is get in the way/make a mess/die...
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Postby ravanwin » Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:57 pm

i don't think we should devide it between the groups.
it is a challenging job but it is important and people who understand that will get / stay involved.
let's not go to deep into that.

FOH makes forest look cooler on a daily basis
Forest Arts group would claim to do the same.

at times their aims (and all of ours) will overlap and they will need to work together to form soloutions. That is cool and what we want, right. Forest WG only need get involved if there is major conflict. true?
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Postby Shannon » Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:29 pm

I like the way Jane separated things. An upstairs mural or upstairs wall colour change is a big deal and should be brought up to the Forest wg. If Forest arts wants to do some table tops they can hook up with foh, and if foh needs some art skills in the table top department they can hook up with front of house. Et cetera.

I agree that foh is important and I really think it will get taken on - even the stuff people see as being boring. Some people get great (strange) satisfaction about a clean floor or touching up paint. Even if they don't, they love Forest and know it'll be better when it's done, or they do it because they're also getting to do some really cool shit with furniture or lampshades, or whatever.

Who knows: maybe there will be a big cross-over between the groups and they'll decide they want to be one. But for now, I think we should come up with an area of responsibility for foh and see how it works. (I reckon we'll be busy with general upkeep in the beginning, anyway.)

It would be good to have some input from galleries/visual arts on this...
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Postby chris » Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:53 pm

what is forest arts? theres no wg called that is there? is it galleries/visual arts ...?
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Postby Shannon » Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:00 am

sorry - I meant galleries/visual arts. Oops. :oops:
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Postby chris » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:07 pm

also i think cleaning the windows falls into foh.
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Maybe it could work? But it will be a kaleidoscopic blend of mysterious shadows and rainbow hued-dreams seen through compassionate tears.


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